NYCPHP Meetup

[Ben Sgro]

well said! +1,400,000

Peter Sawczynec wrote:
> I would posit that there has been a tipping point in all programming and
> related fields including webmastering. 
>
> That the days of stringing together some solid text pages that all ran
> off a little recycled personal server that laid unsecured on the floor
> under your desk are over and the content you served has basically
> anecdotal info about stuff.
>
> Today the internet has become a commerce channel, a medical tool, a
> financial conduit, a personal diary/finance/calendar life organizer, an
> entertainment machine, the defacto news bringer, the banking network, an
> education tool.
>
> So whether working on nuclear tools, ecommerce tools or personal
> calendar tools -- there is nothing left on the internet any more that
> isn't a database driven, entertainment/financial/medical/planning
> conduit of tremendous personal import to millions of people. 
>
> The pervasive need for accuracy, precision, truth, ethics and privacy is
> through the roof. 
>
> I would still agree with Dr. LeJeune, other industries (even chefing)
> have schools and egregiously difficult accreditations that through trial
> by fire the vast majority of participants have agreed to and come to the
> vital conclusion that we need standards.
>
> If I could wave a wand there would be association accreditations for
> programming that were industry and academically recognized.
>
> If I were running a financial institution with interactive financial
> tools that reach in to millions of peoples bank accounts, I would be
> damn straight strict about the quality, aptitude and proven ethics and
> skills of my workers. I think that needs to be a fact today or get out
> of this business because I and a lot of consumers depend quite blindly
> every day that there really is some type of morality and honest purpose,
> proper coordination and genuine financial skill behind all the tools we
> use on the internet every day.
>
> We need standards. One day there will yet be some massive financial
> blowup where someone is going to learn that some interest calculating
> script in an international money market fund was off by 1/100ths of a
> penny on 33% of transactions and accidentally over 16 years time over
> $400,000,000 in interest earnings were never applied to account holders.
> And one of them will be a senator who lost $1,400,000 and then what? 
>
> What incident are you waiting for?
>
> Peter
>    
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: talk-bounces at lists.nyphp.org [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nyphp.org]
> On Behalf Of Webmaster
> Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2008 9:44 AM
> To: NYPHP Talk
> Subject: Re: [nycphp-talk] Re: OT: webmaster test
>
> I'm not certain of 'Houghton Mifflin' (and whatever traces of etymology 
> they use in that particular edition), but the word itself actually comes
>
> from the monastics/priests, in which one would 'profess' their belief. 
> It was later adapted to professional, or 'one who professed an 
> understanding of a skill'. It has never been attached to formal 
> education or academic achievement; that would be 'academic', 
> 'baccalaureate </index.php?term=baccalaureate>', 'esquire' or 'master'. 
> (And I hope you're not seeking your etymological proofs from wikipedia)
>
> Clearly the word has been equivocated in this discussion, and I strongly
>
> suggest that a Webmaster is a 'professional', in his capacity (not 
> requiring a third party approval), for he is not 'professing' to have 
> skills of basket-weaving or ministry, but to have skills of a specific 
> nature and practice pertaining solely to 'webmastering'. These skills 
> could be verified by a third party, but that verification is not the 
> foundation upon which a profession is established. Professions are 
> established by a particular set of skills being required to perform a 
> particular task, or set of tasks. Hence a professional 'handy-man', 
> 'professional student', 'professional football player', 'professional 
> actor'. The entire concept to be carried in the word is to cognitively 
> separate those who have mastered particular skills from those who are 
> acquiring particular skills (aka Professional VS Amateur).
>
> Then again, the word itself began in a society and time of greater moral
>
> concentration, so perhaps you assume that anyone who refers to 
> themselves as a professional today, is either lying (if they haven't a 
> third party 'approval' or tertiary educational document) or is 
> equivocating upon the word, and actually means 'academic', 
> 'baccalaureate </index.php?term=baccalaureate>', 'esquire' or 'master' 
> of 'webmastering'.
>
> Never-the-less, referencing oneself as a 'professional' is not based 
> upon academic merit, but upon personal, occupational self-reflection. 
> Whether-or-not that reflection is an accurate one leads to a different 
> discussion.
>
> As an old friend once told me: "If you call yourself professional, don't
>
> turn out to be a Shmegegge"
>
> -My two (well ok three) cents
>
>
> Urb LeJeune wrote:
>   
>>>>  By definition, programming and website design is not a
>>>> profession.
>>>>         
>>> Really? What specifically is that definition?
>>>       
>> profession: "An occupation, such as law, medicine, or engineering, 
>> that requires considerable training
>> and specialized study"
>>
>> Houghton Mifflin Dictionary.
>>
>> Even an engineer must have a professional engineering (PE) designation
>>     
>
>   
>> to perform certain types of design.
>> I don't have a problem with a self taught programmers, I've known some
>>     
>
>   
>> great ones, however, a field having
>> a large number of practitioners without formal training is a trade not
>>     
>
>   
>> a profession. A profession is also
>> self-regulated.
>>
>> It's another thread but, should there be certification available for 
>> programmers and web designers? If we
>> ever want to be considered a profession, that's the first step. I was 
>> in the stock brokerage business when
>> the designation Chartered Financial Analyst (CFA) first came into 
>> being. It was extraordinarily difficult
>> and it took almost two years after the announcement before the first 
>> designation were awarded. It required
>> two 8 hour day testing sessions. It made a huge difference in the 
>> industry and these days you will not get
>> a senior level job in a research department without a CFA. Same thing 
>> happened with Chartered Financial
>> Planner (CFP).
>>
>> I'm unsure of the procedure, but how/when does one change the subject 
>> when we have drifted into a new
>> area?
>>
>>
>> Urb
>>
>> Dr. Urban A. LeJeune, President
>> E-Government.com
>> 609-294-0320  800-204-9545
>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> E-Government.com lowers you costs while increasing your expectations.
>>
>>
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>>     
>
>
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